Re: FN-FORUM taking discussions off-list & OT posts (was Peter McCormack etc.)

date posted 1st April 2000 18:01

Peter McCormack wrote:

> Ha ha ha

Ho ho ho

------------------------

Peter Small wrote:

> George Dillon being cross at Peter McCormack for posting an off line
post to the list... betraying a confidence, but...

In the message to which I responded off-list, Peter McCormack wrote
"if any of you are interested please give me a call on my mobile so
that we can talk further about the details and plan of action", thus
inviting off-list responses. The implication is that any further
discussion arising from his post would not be done in public.

> I was probably in the wrong for taking a discussion off list...

No you weren't. That was your choice/judgement. Knowing when to take
discussions off-list is essential to responsible list behaviour. It
is the right thing to do if you feel that your response to the
original post is either a) straying too far off topic or b) too
embarrassingly newbie-ish to be of interest to the list or c) private
or d) likely to start a flame-war. The other party could choose not
to reply to you at all or to post their own answers back to the list,
if they consider your question has an answer of public interest.

However, to copy your private message to a public forum is not only
bad etiquette in my view, but it is also of dubious legality. [ Apart
from copyright and confidence issues, consider in the light of the
recent demon case, the situation where that message to Peter had not
*actually* come from me, and let's say for example that it had really
been hostile or even that it had contained a virus... and Peter then
publicly cried foul triggering a mass hostile response from his
multitude of friends and sympathisers. When the dust settled, Peter
would find himself in deep legal shit. ]

What IS wrong is bringing off-list discussions back on-list unless
there is a valid reason for making that discussion public (and/or both
parties are in agreement that their words be made public). Valid
reasons would include the conclusion of a discussion the results of
which would be of interest to the list, or the reporting back to the
list the discovery that someone was abusing it somehow. Valid reasons
DO NOT include making public a private disagreement, or revealing
information which has, specifically, been passed to you privately and
by implication in confidence.

On this occasion there was no great harm done, but the principal is
important and my annoyance was not so much at my own embarrassment
(which was slight), but at what I regard as further example of
McCormack's immaturity and another (albeit mild) misuse of this list.

Paul wrote:

> I belong to several lists where there is much 'off-topic' posting.

+1

> The listmoms always try to keep it down...

For a good reason - it's not what the lists are for, and too much OT
traffic can lead to the busier (and often more experienced) listees
leaving. We've already had one noisy exit from this list. I believe
there are many heavyweights lurking here, waiting to see how this list
develops before breaking cover.

> Much of the off-topic mail is fascinating...

+1. Actually I'm a serial OT offender on a couple of other lists, and
I too love a bit of banter. I filter all my incoming list mail by
subject and get quite excited when I see my OT folder filling up
rapidly (usually on Fridays!) However, wherever I am, when I go
shamelessly OT myself, I try to observe a principal they have over at
evolt.org by 'paying' for straying OT with an on-topic tip. It's
beautifully simple but effective rule and one which should be adopted
here immediately.



For a table with some fixed width and some fluid cells, try setting
the widths of your fixed cells to "-1%" (to prevent them expanding)
and putting a spacer image in them set to the desired width (to
prevent them collapsing). Then give all the other cells widths
totalling 100%. Not standard, but it works in IE, NN and Opera where
other methods fail.

(Thanks to Oliver Lineham)



Hmmm, okay maybe that was a bit OT - more appropriate for Babble than
FN-Forum - but it got me going this week.

> Lists are amazing, and the best way I know to get information
> and ideas and friends :-)

+1. I've received this list since day 2 (damn - slow start!), and I
have faith that when it settles down it will be one of the most
valuable around, but frankly the jury's still out and it's up to all
of us to make this thing work.

Peace and good will to all, even Pete McCormack! :)

George